410. Talking Impact Investment and ESG’s with a BlackRock Executive | Terrence Keeley | The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast

Intro

In this episode of “The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast,” Jordan Peterson interviews Terrence Keeley, a BlackRock executive and expert on impact investment and environmental, social, and governance (ESG) investing. They discuss the promises and pitfalls of ethical investing and the importance of creating a positive future narrative. Keeley shares personal stories and insights on sustainability, economic growth, and the need for trade-offs. The conversation also explores the complexities of the environmental emergency, the role of the free market in driving positive change, and the responsibility we owe to future generations.

Main Takeaways

Impact Investing and ESG

• ESG investing emerged from the United Nations’ sustainable development goals and investment principles.
• ESG principles highlight environmental, social, and governance issues relevant to institutions.
• ESG rules have unintended consequences and may not be an effective financial strategy.
• Impact investing offers a more effective approach, focusing on initiatives that genuinely address inclusivity and sustainability.

Creating a Positive Future Narrative

• Having faith in a positive vision of the future is crucial for moving forward.
• The future is not inherently disastrous, and it’s up to us to create the world we deserve.
• Emphasizing the need for trade-offs and prosperity for all, especially in terms of access to electricity.
• Acknowledging human influence on the environment and the need for sustainability.

The Complexity of the Environmental Emergency

• The environmental emergency is complex and multi-dimensional, but can be simplified to a single theory of climate-related issues attributed mainly to carbon dioxide.
• Oversimplifying the climate crisis by reducing it to just carbon dioxide reduction eliminates the need for critical thinking and genuine moral effort.
• The oversimplification can lead to demonizing those who stand in the way, allowing vengeful resentment-driven hypothetical justice to take over.
• The combination of oversimplification factually, reductionism on the moral side, and the provision of a world for vengeful resentment-driven hypothetical justice presents an apocalyptic danger.

The Role of the Free Market

• The free market system, driven by billions of consumer decisions, plays a crucial role in shaping the direction of global progress.
• Balance of Nature offers whole food supplements made from fruits and vegetables, without any additives, fillers, or synthetics.
• The free market is a system of distributed computation that can make trade-offs and pricing decisions based on local data, making it more efficient than centralized planning.
• Top-down solutions, such as mandating electric vehicles and clean energy solutions, may not align with bottom-up demand, leading to market challenges.

Investing for Social Impact

• Investments should have verifiable additionality to create solutions that wouldn’t happen without the investment.
• There are numerous organizations with proven pedagogies that improve inclusivity and sustainability without compromising economic growth.
• Affordable housing is a key area of investment to address homelessness and wealth building.
• There are affordable solutions for various global challenges, such as homelessness, recidivism, and infant and mother nutrition.

Summary

Terrence Keeley: Expert on ESG Investing

Terrence Keeley, a BlackRock executive and expert on ESG investing, joins Jordan Peterson to discuss the promises and pitfalls of ethical investing. ESG investing emerged from the United Nations’ sustainable development goals and investment principles, aiming to highlight environmental, social, and governance issues relevant to institutions. However, Keeley raises concerns about the unintended consequences of ESG rules and their effectiveness as a financial strategy. He advocates for impact investing, which focuses on initiatives that genuinely address inclusivity and sustainability.

The Importance of Creating a Positive Future Narrative

Keeley emphasizes the need for faith in a positive vision of the future and the belief that it is up to us to create the world we deserve. He highlights the importance of trade-offs and prosperity for all, particularly in terms of access to electricity. Keeley acknowledges the human influence on the environment and the need for sustainability. By shifting the narrative away from a disastrous future and focusing on practical solutions, we can inspire positive change.

The Complexity of the Environmental Emergency

Keeley discusses the complexity of the environmental emergency and the dangers of oversimplification. While carbon dioxide reduction is important, reducing the climate crisis to just one factor eliminates the need for critical thinking and genuine moral effort. Oversimplification can lead to demonizing those who oppose certain measures and the rise of vengeful resentment-driven hypothetical justice. Keeley warns that this combination presents an apocalyptic danger to society.

The Role of the Free Market in Driving Positive Change

Keeley highlights the crucial role of the free market system in shaping global progress. The free market, driven by billions of consumer decisions, can make trade-offs and pricing decisions based on local data, making it more efficient than centralized planning. He discusses the challenges of top-down solutions, such as mandating electric vehicles, which may not align with bottom-up demand. Keeley emphasizes the importance of mindful consumption and investment patterns to guide the free market towards positive change.

Investing for Social Impact

Keeley emphasizes the importance of investing for social impact and supporting initiatives that address global challenges. He highlights the need for investments to have verifiable additionality, creating solutions that wouldn’t happen without the investment. Keeley discusses various organizations with proven pedagogies that improve inclusivity and sustainability without compromising economic growth. He highlights affordable housing as a key area of investment to address homelessness and promote wealth building. Keeley encourages individuals to explore affordable solutions for various global challenges.

Conclusion

Terrence Keeley’s discussion with Jordan Peterson sheds light on the promises and pitfalls of ethical investing. While ESG investing has gained popularity, Keeley raises concerns about its unintended consequences and suggests impact investing as a more effective approach. He emphasizes the importance of creating a positive future narrative, acknowledging the complexity of the environmental emergency, and understanding the role of the free market in driving positive change. Keeley advocates for investing in initiatives that have verifiable social impact and address global challenges. By embracing a mindful and inclusive approach, we can work towards a sustainable and prosperous future.