The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast – 366. The Dangers of Being a Germophobe | Steve Templeton

Intro

In this episode of “The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast,” Jordan Peterson sits down with Steve Templeton to discuss the dangers of being a germaphobe and the impact of safety culture on our lives. They delve into the response to the COVID-19 pandemic, the relationship between safety culture and authoritarianism, and the consequences of excessive cleanliness. Templeton also shares insights from his book, “Fear of a Microbial Planet,” and explores how our obsession with avoiding germs can actually make us less safe.

Main Takeaways

The Impact of Safety Culture

• Safety culture may make us globally less safe, especially in germaphobic safety culture.
• Our obsession with avoiding germs is not helpful because we are already in a microbial world.
• Increased cleanliness has resulted in first-world diseases like auto-immunity and allergies.
• The pandemic took people by surprise, and many did not anticipate the response to it.
• People’s appetite for safety led to their lives being completely controlled by politicians.

The Age-Stratified Response to the Pandemic

• The response to the pandemic was age-stratified in terms of mortality, and children were not really affected.
• The response to the pandemic became more like an autoimmune response, attacking things that didn’t matter, like schools, and issuing mandates without evidence.
• Political considerations overrode research on disgust sensitivity and conservatism, with conservatives rejecting mandates and coercive public health measures.
• Conscientious people are more disgust-sensitive, but there was a surprising lack of correlation between conservatism and disgust sensitivity in pandemic response.
• Left-wing authoritarianism is a newly recognized psychological concept.

The Relationship Between Safety Culture and Authoritarianism

• Studies show that low verbal intelligence, being female, and having a feminine temperament are predictors of radical left-wing beliefs combined with the willingness to use compulsion and force to enforce them.
• Dark tetrad traits, including Machiavellianism, psychopathy, narcissism, and sadism, have a strong relationship with left-wing authoritarianism.
• COVID lockdown policies were implemented based on opinion polls and then provided with a post-hoc justification with the science.
• Disgust reaction may foster part of right-wing authoritarianism.
• Malignant narcissism has an unbelievably strong correlation with left-wing authoritarianism.

The Toll of Lockdowns and Safety Culture

• Lockdowns were orders of magnitude worse than the virus itself, causing accruing catastrophe.
• Excess death statistics suggest lockdowns hurt people badly.
• The lifting of pandemic restrictions and requirements is a positive thing, but it’s unclear why it happened.
• There needs to be a real accounting of what happened during the pandemic and why it happened.
• Eliminating respiratory viruses from the air is a dangerous idea.

Summary

The Impact of Safety Culture

Safety culture, particularly in germaphobic contexts, may paradoxically make us less safe. Our obsession with avoiding germs overlooks the fact that we are already surrounded by microbes. Increased cleanliness has led to the rise of first-world diseases like auto-immunity and allergies. The response to the COVID-19 pandemic caught many off-guard, and people’s desire for safety resulted in their lives being controlled by politicians.

The Age-Stratified Response to the Pandemic

The response to the pandemic was age-stratified, with children being minimally affected. However, the response became more like an autoimmune reaction, targeting schools and issuing mandates without sufficient evidence. Political considerations often overrode research on disgust sensitivity and conservatism. Surprisingly, there was a lack of correlation between conservatism and disgust sensitivity in pandemic response. The emergence of left-wing authoritarianism as a psychological concept sheds light on certain predictors and traits.

The Relationship Between Safety Culture and Authoritarianism

Studies reveal that low verbal intelligence, being female, and having a feminine temperament are associated with radical left-wing beliefs combined with a willingness to enforce them through compulsion and force. Dark tetrad traits, such as Machiavellianism, psychopathy, narcissism, and sadism, exhibit a strong connection with left-wing authoritarianism. Lockdown policies were often driven by public opinion rather than scientific evidence. Disgust reactions play a role in fostering right-wing authoritarianism, while malignant narcissism strongly correlates with left-wing authoritarianism.

The Toll of Lockdowns and Safety Culture

Lockdowns proved to be far more detrimental than the virus itself, resulting in accumulating catastrophes. Excess death statistics indicate the severe impact of lockdowns on people’s well-being. The lifting of restrictions during the pandemic is a positive development, but the reasons behind it remain unclear. An honest assessment of what transpired during the pandemic is necessary. The notion of eliminating respiratory viruses from the air is dangerous. Safety culture, while important, can be taken to extreme levels, leading to unintended consequences.

Conclusion

The conversation between Jordan Peterson and Steve Templeton sheds light on the dangers of safety culture and the response to the COVID-19 pandemic. It highlights the need for a balanced approach to safety, acknowledging that excessive measures can have unintended negative consequences. The relationship between safety culture and authoritarianism, along with the toll of lockdowns, raises important questions about individual freedoms and the role of government. Moving forward, it is crucial to learn from this experience and find ways to respond to future crises without sacrificing essential aspects of our lives and communities.