Intro
In this episode of “The Prof G Pod with Scott Galloway,” Scott Galloway has a conversation with Rutger Bregman, a Dutch historian and author. They discuss various topics including human nature, power dynamics, and the concept of Universal Basic Income (UBI). Rutger Bregman challenges the belief that humans are inherently selfish and driven, presenting evidence from history, psychology, and real-life examples to support his arguments.
Main Takeaways
The Britney Spears conspiracy theory and what it says about fandom
- The conversation begins with a discussion of the Britney Spears conspiracy theory, highlighting the extreme behavior of some fans and the impact of social media on fandom.
The introduction of Pampers as the world’s first disposable diaper brand
- The podcast touches on the history of consumer products, specifically the introduction of Pampers as the first disposable diaper brand, and its impact on convenience and waste.
Rutger Bregman’s latest book, Human Kind, challenges the belief that humans are inherently selfish and driven
- Rutger Bregman’s book, Human Kind, is discussed, which challenges the widely held belief that humans are primarily motivated by self-interest.
The theory of veneer theory, which has a 2000 year history in Western culture
- The concept of veneer theory, which suggests that civilization is a thin veneer that masks our true nature, is explored in the context of Western culture.
Houten, Netherlands is designed around bicycles and attracts urban designers from all over the world
- The town of Houten in the Netherlands is highlighted as an example of a city designed around bicycles, attracting urban designers from around the world.
The Enlightenment was influenced by orthodox Christianity and ancient Greek philosophy
- The podcast delves into the origins of the Enlightenment, discussing how it was influenced by orthodox Christianity and ancient Greek philosophy.
The idea of competition based on the assumption that people are fundamentally selfish is at the heart of our modern economy
- The conversation explores the notion that our modern economy is built on the assumption that people are inherently selfish and competitive.
The book argues against the theory that people are fundamentally selfish
- Rutger Bregman’s book argues against the prevalent theory that people are fundamentally selfish, presenting evidence to support a more hopeful worldview.
There are examples of successful organizations that practice self-directed teams and a more hopeful worldview, such as Buurtzorg in the Netherlands
- The podcast highlights examples of organizations, like Buurtzorg in the Netherlands, that operate on the principles of self-directed teams and a more optimistic view of human nature.
Northern Europe has adopted more principles of collective concern, leading to happier societies with less fear of losing everything
- The conversation touches on the societal differences in Northern Europe, where collective concern and social safety nets have led to happier societies with less fear of losing everything.
Human nature is not fundamentally selfish, as commonly believed
- Rutger Bregman challenges the common belief that human nature is fundamentally selfish, presenting evidence from psychology, history, and anthropology.
Famous experiments like the Milgram and Stanford Prison experiments were examples of “fake science”
- The podcast discusses famous psychological experiments like the Milgram and Stanford Prison experiments, questioning their validity and labeling them as “fake science.”
Lord of the Flies is not an accurate representation of how humans behave in real life situations
- Rutger Bregman challenges the portrayal of human behavior in the novel Lord of the Flies, arguing that it does not accurately reflect how humans behave in real-life situations.
An article in Tonga tells the story of six boys who survived 15 months on a deserted island, relying on the power of friendship
- The podcast shares the story of six boys from Tonga who survived for 15 months on a deserted island, highlighting the power of friendship and cooperation.
Evolutionary psychologist Brian Hare coined the term “survival of the friendliest” to explain how humans have evolved to cooperate and be empathetic towards each other.
- The concept of “survival of the friendliest” is introduced, explaining how humans have evolved to prioritize cooperation and empathy.
Humans have conquered the globe not because of intelligence or violence, but because of “survival of the friendliest”
- Rutger Bregman argues that humans have been successful in conquering the globe not solely due to intelligence or violence, but because of our ability to cooperate and be friendly.
Friendliness was an adaptive trait for survival among hunter-gatherers
- The podcast explores how friendliness and cooperation were adaptive traits for survival among early hunter-gatherer societies.
Domestication in animals and humans involves selecting for tamer traits, including playfulness and slower growth
- Rutger Bregman discusses the concept of domestication, explaining how it involves selecting for tamer traits in both animals and humans, such as playfulness and slower growth.
Humans may be self-domesticated apes, as friendliness became more adaptive over time
- The podcast explores the idea that humans may be self-domesticated apes, with friendliness becoming increasingly adaptive over time.
Rich and powerful people are generally decent, empathetic, and philanthropic, but can also be blind to certain issues
- Rutger Bregman acknowledges that rich and powerful individuals are often decent, empathetic, and philanthropic, but they can also be blind to certain societal issues.
People at the top of the pyramid may be less knowledgeable about how the whole system works
- The conversation highlights the fact that individuals at the top of the social and economic pyramid may have limited knowledge about how the entire system functions.
Power corrupts, but not everyone equally
- The podcast explores the concept of power and corruption, emphasizing that not everyone is equally susceptible to the corrupting influence of power.
People under the influence of power are less connected to others
- Rutger Bregman discusses the impact of power on individuals, noting that those under the influence of power tend to become less connected to others.
Universal basic income would be like venture capital for the masses
- The concept of Universal Basic Income (UBI) is introduced, with Rutger Bregman describing it as “venture capital for the masses.”
Basic income experiments have shown healthcare costs go down, crime goes down, and kids do better in school.
- The podcast discusses the results of basic income experiments, highlighting positive outcomes such as reduced healthcare costs, decreased crime rates, and improved academic performance among children.
Giving money to relatively poor people is a good idea, and basic income is a simple and efficient method to do something about poverty.
- Rutger Bregman argues that giving money to relatively poor individuals is a beneficial approach, and Universal Basic Income provides a simple and efficient method to address poverty.
Evidence from the developing world suggests that giving money to women may be better as they tend to think more about the kids.
- The conversation touches on evidence from the developing world, indicating that giving money to women may have greater positive impacts, as they tend to prioritize the well-being of their children.
Give Directly is a fantastic NGO that gives money to extremely poor people in places like Uganda or Kenya, and it works incredibly well.
- Rutger Bregman praises the work of Give Directly, an NGO that provides money directly to extremely poor individuals in countries like Uganda and Kenya, highlighting its effectiveness.
The saying “give a man a fish, but teach him how to fish” should be replaced because maybe the man doesn’t like fishing or has other ideas.
- The podcast challenges the traditional saying “give a man a fish, but teach him how to fish,” suggesting that it should be replaced with an approach that considers individual preferences and aspirations.
There are real downsides to traditional European socio-democracy, such as being paternalistic and discouraging entrepreneurship.
- The conversation acknowledges that traditional European socio-democracy has its downsides, including tendencies towards paternalism and discouragement of entrepreneurship.
Milton Friedman advocated for a negative income tax, a version of basic income
- The podcast mentions the advocacy of economist Milton Friedman for a negative income tax, which can be seen as a precursor to the concept of Universal Basic Income.
The US allows for appreciation of weirdness and encourages ambition
- The conversation highlights the cultural aspect of the United States, where there is often an appreciation for individuality and ambition.
Social democratic countries can discourage entrepreneurship and ambition
- Rutger Bregman notes that social democratic countries can sometimes create an environment that discourages entrepreneurship and ambition.
Altruism is often a luxury and a privilege
- The podcast explores the concept of altruism, highlighting that it is often a luxury and privilege that not everyone can afford.
We are part of a lucky minority who have access to extravagant conveniences and won the lottery of life
- The conversation emphasizes the privileged position of the podcast’s audience, acknowledging that they are part of a lucky minority who have access to extravagant conveniences and opportunities.
Passport, country of birth, gender, and ethnicity determine 80% of income according to economist Brankham Milanovic
- Economist Brankham Milanovic’s research is mentioned, revealing that factors such as passport, country of birth, gender, and ethnicity play a significant role in determining 80% of an individual’s income.
There is no such thing as free will, everything is given to us
- Rutger Bregman challenges the concept of free will, suggesting that everything we have is ultimately given to us in some way.
We have a moral duty to help others and do good in the world
- The podcast emphasizes the moral obligation to help others and make positive contributions to the world.
Tax avoidance and evasion has gone haywire because we allowed it to happen
- The conversation discusses the issue of tax avoidance and evasion, attributing its prevalence to societal permissiveness.
Progress is being made with more attention to the issue, minimum corporate tax of 15% agreed upon by the world, and crackdown on tax paradises led by the US
- The podcast highlights the progress being made in addressing tax avoidance and evasion, including the agreement on a minimum corporate tax of 15% and efforts to crack down on tax havens led by the United States.
Sunlight is the best disinfectant in addressing tax avoidance and evasion
- Rutger Bregman suggests that transparency and exposure are essential in combating tax avoidance and evasion.
“Once you see people getting angry, that’s when we’re making progress.” – Rutger Bregman
- Rutger Bregman expresses his belief that anger and outrage are indicators of progress and a catalyst for change.
Parents who instill a strong sense of moral duty in their children help them develop a strong moral compass
- The podcast discusses the role of parents in shaping their children’s moral compass, emphasizing the importance of instilling a strong sense of moral duty.
Kids get a lot of freedom to make their own judgments, but parents explain the rules and why certain actions have consequences
- The conversation highlights the balance between granting children freedom to make their own judgments while also providing guidance by explaining rules and the consequences of actions.
The most important characteristic of resistance heroes during WWII was that they were asked to join the resistance
- The podcast explores the characteristics of resistance heroes during World War II, noting that the most important factor was being asked to join the resistance.
Freedom and agency are important values to instill in children
- Rutger Bregman emphasizes the importance of instilling values of freedom and agency in children, allowing them to develop a sense of autonomy and independence.
Spamming (sending many emails to many people) can be more effective than sending one perfect pitch to one person
- The podcast discusses the effectiveness of spamming, highlighting that sending many emails to many people can sometimes yield better results than focusing on one perfect pitch to one person.
Throwing a lot of darts is a function of your ability and willingness to endure rejection
- The conversation explores the idea that throwing a lot of darts (taking many chances) is a reflection of an individual’s ability and willingness to endure rejection.
Making mistakes is essential to learning and growing in your career
- Rutger Bregman emphasizes the importance of making mistakes in one’s career, highlighting that they are essential for learning and personal growth.
Enduring rejection is a skill that can be difficult to teach
- The podcast acknowledges that enduring rejection is a skill that can be challenging to teach, but one that is crucial for success.
Rutger Braggman is a Dutch historian and author, described as the Dutch wonder kind of new ideas
- Rutger Bregman is introduced as a Dutch historian and author, known as the “Dutch wonder kid of new ideas.”
Summary
Challenging the Notion of Human Nature
Rutger Bregman challenges the commonly held belief that humans are inherently selfish and driven. He presents evidence from history, psychology, and real-life examples to argue that human nature is not fundamentally selfish. Bregman explores the concept of “survival of the friendliest,” emphasizing the importance of cooperation and empathy in human evolution. He debunks famous psychological experiments and fictional portrayals that perpetuate the idea of inherent selfishness, advocating for a more hopeful worldview.
Power Dynamics and Philanthropy
The conversation delves into the dynamics of power and philanthropy. While acknowledging that rich and powerful individuals can be decent and philanthropic, Bregman highlights their potential blind spots and limited understanding of the whole system. He discusses the corrupting influence of power and the disconnection it creates from others. The podcast also explores the concept of Universal Basic Income (UBI) as a means to address poverty and inequality, presenting evidence from experiments and organizations that support its effectiveness. Bregman emphasizes the importance of addressing tax avoidance and evasion, advocating for transparency and accountability.
Nurturing Moral Compass and Freedom
Rutger Bregman emphasizes the role of parents in nurturing their children’s moral compass and instilling values of freedom and agency. He discusses the importance of allowing children to make their own judgments while providing guidance and explaining the rules and consequences. The podcast also touches on the characteristics of resistance heroes during World War II, highlighting the significance of being asked to join the resistance. Bregman encourages embracing mistakes and enduring rejection as essential for learning and personal growth.
Conclusion
In this episode, Rutger Bregman challenges the prevailing belief in human selfishness, presenting a more hopeful and cooperative view of human nature. He explores the dynamics of power, the potential of Universal Basic Income, and the importance of addressing societal issues such as tax avoidance. Bregman emphasizes the role of parents in shaping moral values and encourages embracing mistakes and enduring rejection as part of personal growth. Overall, this conversation offers thought-provoking insights into human behavior, power dynamics, and the potential for positive change.
